Most creators think you need a massive audience to make real money. Phil Pallen is proof you don’t.

He will finish 2025 close to 7-figures in revenue — while barely having 6-figures in followers across platforms.

In this episode, Justin and Grace break down how Phil built a highly profitable creator-consultant business by positioning himself correctly, charging like a strategist, and letting his content do the inbound work for him.

Inside:

💡 The 3 pillars of a personal brand that actually sells

📱 Why follower count ≠ revenue (Phil is the perfect example)

💸 How he prices strategy, consulting, and brand builds

🔄 Rebranding yourself after a pivot (and why most people do it wrong)

📈 How Phil structures his business to stay creative and profitable

Timestamps:

00:00 – Phil Pallen’s business model

06:12 – Why most personal brands fail

12:45 – The 3 pillars of a high-trust personal brand

20:10 – Follower count vs. credibility (Phil’s anti-vanity approach)

26:30 – Creating content that attracts inbound leads

34:15 – Pricing yourself as a strategist, not a freelancer

41:20 – How to rebrand after a pivot

47:50 – Building an agency that scales your creative work

53:10 – Final takeaways

🎙️ Hosted by Grace Ling & Justin Nguyen

📍 How Creators Make Money — the podcast where we unpack the real strategies behind today’s smartest creators.