The informal is normal. Beyond being the norm in many countries around the world it is also essential, enduring, and transformative. Where the "formal" falls short in light of rapid urbanisation and responding to external shocks, the informal takes over providing solutions and opportunities for billions around the world. To unpack this further Prof. Marleen Dekker (Africa Studies Centre Leiden) and Ms. Hafou Toure-Samb (Tecnhical Advisor Minister of Trade and Industry of Côte d'Ivoire) and moderator, sit around the virtual table with Ms. Mandipa Ndlovu (Africa Studies Centre Leiden)