I’ve always struggled with hobbies. If I couldn’t make money from it, was it really worth my time?

In this episode, I talk with Mike Drysdale—founder, Chief Mystery Officer of Folklore, and creative strategist—about the value of play for the sake of play. Mike helps me unpack why hobbies matter, even when they aren’t productive in the traditional sense.

We explore the role of creativity in adult life, the challenge of building trust in group settings, and how Folklore uses games to strengthen team culture and psychological safety. Whether in our personal lives or professional spaces, Mike shows us how play, community, and creativity are essential, not optional for a more fulfilled life.