‘Hope shows up when we are fighting for justice. Hope shows up when we show up making clear that the way things are is not the way they are destined to be, that the way things are is not God's promise for us.’ Join Kelly Brown-Douglas and Paula Gooder, as they reflect together on vocation and preaching, on racial justice and, most importantly, on hope. Kelly Brown-Douglas is an African-American priest in the Episcopal Church in the USA. She is a leading voice in womanist theology and racial justice, and is a brilliant preacher and communicator. Paula Gooder is Canon Chancellor of St Paul’s Cathedral.