In this rich and multidimensional conversation, Scott Schwenk is joined by Saniel and Linda Groves-Bonder—founders of the Waking Down in Mutuality work—for a dialogue on what it means to live a fully awakened and fully human life. Together, they explore the paradox of recognizing ourselves as being radiantly whole simultaneously with flaws and lots of room to grow, the power of mutuality in relationships, and why awakening doesn't mean erasing your ego.  This episode is a deep dive into radical embodiment, healthy shadow work, and the courage to be known and shows how relationships hold a mirror up for the ongoing inner work. Saniel Bonder and Linda Groves-Bonder have developed a relational, integrative, and readily accessible breakthrough approach to spiritual enlightenment and wholeness best known as Waking Down in Mutuality®. For over three decades, as pioneering coaches of this embodied process they've taken enlightenment from remote temples and 'Olympic athletes' of spiritual practice, evolved it into a humane, ethical process and realization, and conveyed it into the towns, households, and workplaces of everyday people globally.  Born in 1950, Saniel was a Harvard Honorary National Scholar, earning a B.A. in Social Relations. After completing his spiritual quest, he has spent 30+ years "democratizing" awakened living with Linda and others. He has authored many spiritual books, including Waking Down and Healing the Spirit/Matter Split, and two novels.  Linda graduated from Ball State University with a B.S. in Art Education. A singer-songwriter, photo stylist, and artist, she toured with an international band and has released two solo albums, I'm Here and Joy of Being. Since 1996 she has focused with Saniel on teaching intensive transformation through their total suite of offerings, now known as the Human Sun HEART Work™.  Learn more about Saniel & Linda and Waking Down® at www.sanielandlinda.com and check out their main introductory offering at maxjoyinfo.com.   Scott Schwenk  Scott's teachings, courses and private mentoring guide leaders, seekers and creatives to explore their deepest selves in service of thriving on all levels of being, both individually and relationally. You can receive a free guided meditation and explore Scott's courses, workshops, retreats, training and master coaching at https://scottschwenk.com and can find him on Instagram @thescottschwenk.