What is awe, and how is this emotion exploited by cults? How is awe related to infatuation, to the experience of falling in love romantically, and what has it got to do with babies and cults? How can humour be used to breakdown the residual after effects of awe for those who have left cults? Join us for a fascinating conversation with Dr Yuval Laor about these emotions and how they are manipulated in cults and how understanding their effects can support recovery.
Lindy has an interesting chat with Rose Stanley about burnout, boundaries, the need for a sane spirituality and how to rebuild with clarity, courage, and compassion. The Cult Chat team then joins the discussion to unpack what healthy spiritual life really looks like. This episode offers a gentle, practical guide to staying sane and whole in faith spaces.
This week we meet Jonas, stand-up comedian, former Jehovah’s Witness, and goat-farmer living in Norway. Laugh along with the Cult Chat trio as they learn what it is that goats and worldly people have in common, and exactly how Jonas decides which parts of being in a cult are ok to joke about. This episode comes in advance of Jonas’ trip to New Zealand in January where he will be staging a peaceful protest at the Annual Jehovah's Witness convention and touring NZ with his Doomsday comedy show.
Why are there often more women than men in cults, and is it harder for women to leave? What is reproductive coercion? How is it used in cults to control the freedoms and choices of women? Join the Cult Chat trio for this important conversation as they explore the unique vulnerabilities that women have in cults and how these vulnerabilities are often targeted and exploited. Trigger warning - discussion of suicide.
Show notes
Podcast - Cult Chat Episode 24 - Coercive Control - What is it? https://youtu.be/HO5TRYdZCX4?si=-X5pB7RIBx2ly6PJ
Podcast - Cult Chat Episode 25 - Coercive Control - Is it Legal? https://youtu.be/z93AopyG6Pk?si=OHvQLFzEnyYkhwLo
Website - Cult-Informed Professional Network - www.cipnetwork.org
Podcast - Cult Chat Episode 77 - Life for Women in 2x2s with Veronica & Lindsay (P2) https://youtu.be/ZRwOSFL_VKo?si=lVFcaOGCyjUQUuvJ
Journal article - The health impacts of women's low control in their living environment: A theory-based systematic review of observational studies in societies with profound gender discrimination - Pennington et al Health Place Journal 2018 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29482064/
Thesis - Understanding Reproductive Coercion in Cults and Destructive Group Settings by Ashlen Weltz https://library.internationalculticstudies.org/24nbuck/~~PdfSource/0
Article - As Belgium Races to Save U.S.A.I.D. Contraception, Some Supplies Are Reported Ruined - New York Times - https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/12/world/europe/belgium-usaid-contraception.html
Website - Briell Decker - FLDS survivor and wife of Warren Jeffs - https://www.brielldecker.com/about-1
Get ready for a challenging but extremely important conversation with Debbs Murray, founder of Eclipse Family Violence Services. Caz and Debbs chat about the overlap between the world of family violence and cultic harm and how coercive control presents similarly and differently in these parallel contexts. Trigger warning - discussion of suicide and sexual violence.
Show Notes
Website: https://www.eclipsefamilyviolenceservices.co.nz/
Documentary: American Murder - Gabby Petito https://www.imdb.com/title/tt35590630/
Legislation: Family Violence Act 2018 - https://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/2018/0046/latest/lms112966.html
Book: One Soul One Survivor by Debbs Murray - https://www.eclipsefamilyviolenceservices.co.nz/debbs-story
Join us for Part two of our brave interview with Veronica and Lindsay as they share what life was really like for women growing up in the 2x2's (The Truth, The Way, The Church With No Name). Hear their stories of rules (but no rules), control, silence, resilience, and freedom. Then listen in to the Cult Chat Trio as they discuss the interview.
Join us for a brave discussion as Veronica and Lindsay share what life was really like for women growing up in the 2x2's (also known as The Truth, The Way, The Church With No Name). These women are among the first in New Zealand to speak publicly about their experiences inside this secretive religious group. Hear their stories of rules (but no rules), control, silence, resilience, and freedom. Part two next week!
John Lennon’s famous song "Imagine" paints a vision of a perfect world — and cults often promise something similar. So in the spirit of fairness, this week, we take a surprising detour to explore the good things and the benefits that members say about life inside: belonging, structure, shared ideals, and hope for something better. These dreams are powerful — and they can make leaving hard. But are they just an illusion? Listen in, and let us know if we have done the topic justice!
Show Notes
Article: Gloriavale Leavers Support Trust 10 Reasons People Remain at Gloriavale
Article: BBC Australian sect members guilty of causing girl's death - information about the Elizabeth Struhs death
Following their conversation with Dr Steve Hassan in part 1, our hosts kept talking! In this part 2 of the conversation they talk about the importance of survivor voices in research, and why historically some researchers have appeared to listen to cult leaders rather than cult survivors. They share some illuminating facts about specific cult apologists, and how a minimising narrative has affected New Zealand cult survivors and their fights for truth and justice.
Show notes:
Show notes
Children of God investigations (and Eileen’s involvement) - get from Maria
Article: Secrets, Lies & a Mysterious Cup of Tea - Stuff - the police corruption in the Centrepoint case
Articles: The Cult Apologist Mafia - Luigi Corvaglia - Part 1, Part 2 & Part 3
Website - FECRIS (European Federation of Centres of Research and Information on Cults and Sects)
Article - Meet the Shadowy Scholars Supporting England's Doomsday Cult - Be Schofield
AROPAL & conference page
Steven Kent Article
Article: Dr Norris and the Gloriavale employment court case - Gloriavale Leavers Support Trust
Review of Days of Rain by Mossimo Itrivgne
This week we invite Dr Steven Hassan to join us to discuss the cult apologist movement. Dr Hassan is the author of the BITE Model of Authoritarian Control and the Influence Continuum. In this fascinating conversation we unpack the history behind this propaganda movement, why survivor voices are not welcome in their narratives, and examine why high profile cult apologists like Professor Eileen Barker might be given a platform to speak at academic conferences whose goal is to examine the harms of cults.
Show Notes
Website: London School of Economic and Political Science - Professor Eileen Barker
Website: Freedom of Mind Resource Centre - the Influence Continuum
Professional Development: Understanding Cults for Clinicians - Freedom of Mind
Survey: the use of the Bite Model as a tool for evaluating organisations
Website: Daniel Kahneman’s work on judgement and decision-making
Book: Releasing the Bonds by Dr Steven Hassan
Article: New York Times: Moon’s sect loses libel suit in London
What do cults and extremist terrorist organisations have in common? How are recruitment methods similar, and what are some of the vulnerabilities that such groups exploit in order to attract and retain conscripts? These are some of the questions which Caz and Dr Cyrus Abbasian, London-based psychiatrist, discuss as they explore this topic, covering neurodivergence, mental illness and coercive control in healthcare decision-making, amongst other things.
*Trigger Warning* What exactly is needed for an organisation to be safe for a child? Willow Duffy, co-founder and CEO of Safeguarding Children, answers these questions and more, in a conversation which explores what can be done when an organisation not only fails to have the rights of children at its centre, but instead actively promotes processes which harm children. Is a policy enough when the culture is destructive to a child’s welfare? Join us for this challenging but important conversation.
Gloriavale again! We come back to talk about the other reason that the closed West Coast community is in the news again - this time because the Overseeing Shepherd - the community’s leader, Howard Temple - has just been convicted of indecent assault of numerous girls and women at Gloriavale. Our hosts discuss the culture that allowed his public behaviour to become normal, the impossibility of speaking up as a victim in this community, and what lies behind the entitlement of his actions.
Gloriavale is all over the news again, and for the wrong reasons. This week our hosts talk about the recent Education Review Office report which revealed that the Gloriavale School has failed yet again to meet the basic requirements expected to function as an education provider. Liz explains the background to this report and asks the question, at what point is there enough evidence that this school cannot provide the necessary ingredients to educate children well and safely?
This week we have a bonus episode - part 2 of our conversational expose about the International Cultic Studies Association Conference which Caz went to in Montreal in July. We wrap up our conversation by talking about emerging evidence on child abuse in cults, the relationship between sacred values and the extreme actions a person is willing to take for their group, male experience of cultic abuse, collective narcissism and healing the spiritual self after it has been abused in in a cult.
Show notes
Website: International Cultic Studies Association
Survey - questionnaire for participants wishing to take part in research for people born and raised in cults
LinkedIn profile - Prof Omar Saldana - Identity Fusion -
LinkedIn profile - Dr Andre Jackson - Collective Narcissism
You'll love this pot luck episode! Caz has just returned from the International Cultic Studies Association conference in Montreal, Canada. We’re joined in this episode with ‘friend of the show’ Maria Eguerra who also went to the conference. Maria and Caz fill Lindy and Liz in on their learnings from the conference, covering topics such as neurodiversity, financial abuse, cult apologists, the power of social media for cult survivor activism. We talked so much we had to do a second episode!
Show Notes
Website: International Cultic Studies Association
Website: Get A Life Podcast
Instagram: Ben Woodbury excultboy
LinkedIn: Maria Esguerra
LinkedIn: Heidi Clemons
LinkedIn: Omar Saldana
It is difficult to truly leave a cult if someone you love remains in the group. In this chat Liz, Lindy and Caz talk about the difficult line that former members often have to navigate after leaving because they still have people in their lives who remain in the group. Join us as we discuss setting clear boundaries and keeping yourself safe, understanding what it is you want from the ongoing contact, and the lifeline ongoing contact can offer to your loved ones if they ever decide to leave.
Show Notes
Book: “Cult Trip” - Anke Richter
Podcast episode: Cult Chat episodes 48 & 49 - Health Care and Cults Parts 1 & 2 with Gina Catena
Book: “Walking Free from the Trauma of Coercive, Cultic and Spiritual Abuse” - Gillie Jenkinson
Podcast: Cult Chat episode 57 - Waking Up with Andre Jackson
Did you wake up one day to the realisation that your child has joined a cult? Are you struggling to know what to do? In today’s episode we discuss the challenges of having a cult controlling your relationship with your child, and trying to navigate the best path forward. Parent Renee Spencer talks to Lindy about the journey to understanding what happened and her efforts to reclaim an authentic relationship with her daughter after she was recruited into the Jesus Christians (aka the Kidney Cult).
Show notes
Documentary - The Dark Reality of the Kidney Cult - 7 News Spotlight
Podcast of Liz's experiences of witnessing her daughter join a cult in on YouTube: https://youtu.be/WbUnis4Vyp8
Podcast: Let’s Talk About Sects - The Jesus Christians Part One and Part Two
Podcast: Let’s Talk About Sects - Cult Bride and Providence/JMS with Liz Cameron
Book - Carol Giambalvo - Exit Counseling: A Family Intervention
Article - Carol Giambalvo - Family Interventions for Cult-Affected Loved Ones
Book - Steve Hassan - Combatting Cult Mind Control
ISCA Article - What Impact Does Cult Involvement have on a Family Member
ISCA Article - Steve K. D. Eichel (ICSA) For Families Who Suspect That a Loved One May Be Involved With a High-Demand Group (Cult)
ISCA Website - general information about cult indoctrination for families
Renee’s Website: www.recoverfromcoercivecontrol.com
Today our Cult Chat hosts share what listeners have told them are the best things about life after leaving a cult. From finding space to be who you truly are, to getting the chance to make mistakes, and to being allowed to have the full range of human emotions, this episode digs right down into the wonderful things that leavers can experience once they set out on their new post-cult lives. Be prepared to be moved to tears in this hopeful episode about what you might find on the other side.
Show notes
Website: The Religious Trauma Collective Annual Event - 19-21 June, web-based conference
Website: Decult
Resource: Thinking of Leaving - Olive Leaf Network
In this second of three episodes on leaving, Lindy is joined by Liz Sallows, Canadian psychotherapist and grief expert. Liz and Lindy discuss the unexpected (and often unrecognised) sadness which accompany the freedoms of leaving a cult. There is a lot to grieve - loss of a community, loss of an ideal, loss of everything you have known and love. We will hear about ambiguous loss, the importance of rest after leaving, and why going slow is absolutely ok. Liz shares practical tips and hope for the grieving.
Show notes:
Website: Thresholds of Life Counselling - Liz’s website