Envisioning a Trustworthy Civilization: A Conversation with George Kinder on Fiduciary Principles

In this episode of the Mindful Money Podcast, Jonathan hosts George Kinder to discuss the potential of applying fiduciary principles—putting clients' interests first—beyond financial advice to all institutions, including corporations and governments. George shares his journey and vision for a more humane and trustworthy world, inspired by lessons from the 2008 financial crisis and his global experiences. The conversation dives into systemic changes needed, the feasibility of such transformations, and how these ideas align with and challenge current capitalistic frameworks. George advocates for a grassroots movement driven by these principles, hinting at a future where enhanced trust and ethical standards in all institutions could lead to a more entrepreneurial and sustainable global society.

00:00 Introduction to a Humane and Trustworthy Society

00:48 Welcoming George Kinder and His Vision

00:54 The Fiduciary Standard Beyond Finance

02:09 George's Global Startup and Poetry

03:47 The Three Domains of Freedom

05:24 A Golden Civilization: Global Insights

06:43 Challenges and Philosophical Perspectives

09:35 Defining Fiduciary in All Things (FIAT)

13:15 Human Nature and Systemic Change

17:12 Examples and Practical Applications

21:52 Concerns and Resistance to Change

24:28 Redefining Corporate Greed

26:20 The Role of Truth in Democracy

28:28 Navigating the Complexity of Truth

30:00 The Bell Curve of Truth

32:56 Challenges and Resistance

34:48 The Vision for a Trustworthy World

39:27 Sustainable Business Practices

41:32 Spreading the Mission

46:35 Conclusion and Call to Action

ABOUT MINDFUL MONEY:Do you struggle with money? You’re not alone.Money is a means, not an end. It’s a necessity of life for sure, but more money does not always guarantee a “good life”. Money enables many aspects of modern life, but as a dominant consideration, it becomes destructive.The paradox is that more time and energy spent on personal finance does NOT create better outcomes. Unlike many other parts of life, we can’t create better outcomes by being smarter, spending more time, or putting in more effort.Join Mindful Money author and experienced 40-year investor Jonathan DeYoe as he shares stories from artists, authors, entrepreneurs, and other advisors about how they mindfully minimize their need to think about money and get more out of life.If you aren’t happy with your finances, feel like money takes more time than it should, or want to place your financial decisions into the broader context of your life, this show is for you.Each episode will draw the line between the “enough” activities that the academics tell us are additive to family outcomes, and those “little bit more” efforts that take time and sap energy but do NOT improve outcomes.MINDFUL MONEY RESOURCES:Website: https://mindful.moneyJonathan DeYoe on LinkedIn:   / jonathandeyoe  Mindful Money on X / Twitter: https://x.com/MindfulMoney_EdMindful Money on Facebook:   / mindfulmoneyplan  Mindful Money on Instagram:   / mindfulmoneyplan  Mindful Money on YouTube:    / @mindfulmoney  🎙️Podcast Production by Spoken Podcasts: https://spokenpodcasts.com

Episode Summary

In this episode of Mindful Money, I talk with Bart Wilson about the often-overlooked moral dimension of economics. We explore Adam Smith’s forgotten insights on justice and beneficence, how values shape innovation and prosperity, and why genuine wealth is created through collaboration—not extraction. It’s a thoughtful, hopeful conversation about money’s deeper purpose.

Show Notes

Bart J. Wilson is a Professor of Economics and Law and the Donald P. Kennedy Endowed Chair in Economics and Law at Chapman University. He is a member of the Economic Science Institute, with joint tenured appointments in the Argyros College of Business and Economics and the Fowler School of Law. In 2016, he founded the Smith Institute for Political Economy and Philosophy, where he serves as the director. Bart has published papers widely in economics and general science journals, and is the author of Meaningful Economics: Making the Science of Prosperity More Human; The Property Species: Mine, Yours, and the Human Mind; and Humanomics: Moral Sentiments and the Wealth of Nations for the Twenty-First Century.

I talk with Bart about the moral roots of prosperity. We revisit Adam Smith’s Theory of Moral Sentiments and how justice, beneficence, and collaboration make economic growth possible. Bart shares lessons from his farm upbringing, why commerce is more than self-interest, and how innovation thrives when we respect equality and trust. We also discuss AI, the hidden goodness in markets, and why gifts carry obligations that bind communities together. This conversation reframes economics as a profoundly human endeavor—one that can guide us toward more mindful wealth and purpose.

Meaningful Economics: Making the Science of Prosperity More Human: https://www.amazon.com/Meaningful-Economics-Making-Science-Prosperity/dp/0197758150 

Connect with Bart

• Website: https://www.bartjwilson.com/ 

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bart-wilson-353bba8/ 

• X / Twitter: https://x.com/bartwilson 

Connect with Jonathan

• Website:  https://mindful.money 

• Jonathan DeYoe on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathandeyoe 

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• Mindful Money on Facebook:  https://www.facebook.com/MindfulMoneyPlan 

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In this episode of Mindful Money, we break down the emotional reactions to elections and why we should separate politics from our portfolios. As election-driven fear and speculation rise, it’s important to understand why making investment decisions based on political headlines is a mistake. Markets react to policies, not personalities, and long-term financial success requires discipline, diversification, and patience. In this episode, we’ll explore both potential risks—like tariffs, inflation, and debt—and possible benefits, such as business growth incentives and deregulation. No single election will make or break your financial future, but your mindset and strategy will.