On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• World Juniors officials
• NHL liney Ryan Jackson injured
• Paying Christmas Bills!
• Ducks' Vatrano fined for unsportsmanlike conduct on Stars' Robertson
• Blackhawks' Grzelcyk fined for cross-checking Sens' Stutzle
• Ducks' Johnston fined for a stucker punch on Kraken's Kartye
• No call on Panthers' Rodrigues for taking out Canes' Jarvis ith a dangerous trip that sent him crashing into the goal frame
• Panthers' Marchand hits Canes' Bussi right in the Christmas crackers - then scores on the play
• Rangers' Shesterkin makes a great save on the Caps' Strome... that was juuuust over the line
• At the WJC, Canada's Porter Martone picks up a penalty for a post-goal celebration
• Flames' Weeger gets tossed for a stick-banging tantrum after a penalty call.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

Hands off! We've got a whole slew of hand pass reviews on this week's #RefsPodcast. The rulebook was changed in 2019 to allow challenges for hand passes leading to a goal, but this is the first time we've had four in just over a week. Also on the show:

• Anaheim Ducks' Jacob Trouba lays the hammer on Washington Capitals' Ryan Leonard. The Caps were mad, but was it legal?
• The Ducks' Leo Carlsson gets a shootout goal wiped out for the dreaded double-tap.
• Florida Panthers' Brad Marchand has the puck go off his glove prior to a goal. We'll break down why this WASN'T a hand pass.
• Buffalo Sabres' Alex Tuch bats the puck while holding his stick. Not one we've seen often, but a good precedent-setter for future ruling on why this WAS a hand pass.
• The easiest one of them all - Chicago Blackhawks' Colton Dach plays the puck with his glove then misses it with his stick, resulting in an easy hand pass call that even New York Rangers goaltender Igor Shesterkin caught.
• Tampa Bay Lightning's Gage Goncalves gets ejected for a clear knee-on-knee hit on Toronto Maple Leafs Dakota Mermis that looked intentional. Should he have also been suspended?
• Toronto's Bobby McCann does get suspended for a stick-swinging incident. Was this the right ruling? Not based on what we've seen in the past.
• The Olympic refs are out... sort of. We check out the leaked list of stripes, but expect some of those names to change. We'll tell you why.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

It's a busy week on the #RefsPodcast:

• Jets goalie Thomas Milic picks up a penalty for covering up the puck
• Kraken's Mason Marchment fires up the Edmonton Oilers after a hit on Darnell Nurse
• Penguins' Blake Lizotte with the crotch-hoist on the Flyers' Garnet Hathaway. Should the NHL come down harder on the ol' pickle-smasher?
• Blues' Toropchenko takes out the Utah Mammoth's Logan Cooley with a knee, earning a major penalty but avoiding a fine or suspension
• Sabres' Rasmus Dahlin looked like the only one surprised he was given a major penalty for boarding Trevor Zegras of the Philadelphia Flyers.
• Nashville's Steven Stamkos scores the OT game-winner with Panthers defenseman Gustav Forsling already in there... and the net off its pegs
• A hand pass haunts the Tampa Lay Lightning as Nikita Kucherov's game-tying goal was disallowed after the NHL's Situation Room reviewed the play for a missed stoppage. Was it the right call?

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

It’s a confluence of circumstances on a jam-packed #RefsPodcast:

• The OHL suspends Brampton's Luke Dragusica for the rest of the season for a Marty-McSorleyesque two-handed slash to the head
• Carolina Hurricanes’ Andrei Svechnikov gets the elbow up on Vancouver Canucks’ Filip Hronek
• We’re not seeing any sort of distinct kicking motion on this disallowed goal from San Jose Sharks’ Will Smith… but there might be a good argument for disallowing it.
• George Parros of the NHL’s Department of Player Safety drops in on Lightning vs. Panthers
• The New York Rangers and Detroit Red Wings go old school with the jersey matchup and with a post-game scuffle, along with a controversial holding the stick call on Sam Carrick after a hook from J.T. Compher
• New York Islanders’ Bo Horvat gets four minutes for a high stick after getting tripped up – plus another 10 for arguing the call
• More ugliness from Stars vs. Isles as Mikko Rantanen gets ejected - but not suspended - for a hit that injured defenseman Alex Romanov
• Just moments later, Dallas thinks they’ve tied the game only to have the goal called back for goaltender interference.
• The Buffalo Sabres have their own run-in with goalie interference and the NHL Situation Room when Tage Thompson is ruled to have interfered with the Calgary Flames’ Devin Cooley
• Chicago Blackhawks forward Connor Bedard picks up an abuse of officials penalty for arguing a non-call after getting slashed on a breakaway by Seattle Kraken defenseman Ryan Lindgren
• …and here comes the Washington Capitals’ Tom Wilson!

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On the latest #RefsPodcast:

• Nashville Predators forward Michael Bunting tips a shot into the net vs. the New York Rangers that was just a bit high... but presented an opportunity for some technological enhancements
• Boston Bruins blueliner Nikita Zadorov took out Toronto Maple Leafs captain Auston Matthews, who left the game shortly after. Did it deserve a penalty? Or something more?
• A scary hit from New Jersey Devils defenseman Brenden Dillon took out Tyler Bertuzzi of the Detroit Red Wings. Dillon picked up a penalty and a fine, but was that enough for this high elbow?
• Also, we check in with The Athletic's Rules Court to break down some of their latest suggestions on changes to the NHL rulebook -- including one likely controversial take on penalty shots.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On the latest #RefsPodcast:

• Scoring a goal without actually putting the puck into the net. It's possible, and it happened twice this week - once at Anaheim Ducks vs. Detroit Red Wings and again at Minnesota Wild vs. Nashville Predators
• Red Wings defenseman Moritz Seider has a goal disallowed for a "distinct kicking motion" that wasn't very distinct
• Wings netminder John Gibson bumps the net off prior to a Chris Kreider goal
• The Washington Capitals challenge a New York Islanders offside play that may have been too close to call -- where's our new puck and player tracking when we need it?
• Another no-net-goal came when the Nashville Predators' Justus Annunen bumped the net, creating a rebound off the outside of the net that continued an "imminent scoring chance" that led to a goal.
• Pittsburgh Penguins forward Evgeny Malkin picks up the tab on a $5000 slashing fine for stickwork on the Jets' Logan Stanley.
• Anaheim's Leo Carlsson blows up Florida Panthers forward Evan Rodrigues
• The first match penalty of the season goes to Minnesota's Tyler Pitlick for a headshot on Jaden Chatfield of the Carolina Hurricanes
• Neither hit resulted in a fine nor suspension from the NHL's Department of Player Safety.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

The Pittsburgh Penguins do, at least this week. Also on the latest #RefsPodcast:

• New official debuts as Shawn Oliver, Jeremy Faucher, and Dylan Blujus hit the ice for the first time in the NHL
• Injury updates with Scott Cherrey, Francois St. Laurent, Steve Kozari, Chris Rooney, Ryan Daisy, and Bryan Pancich still sidelined
• Congratulations to referee Chris Lee on 1500 games!
• Major penalty to Blue Jackets’ Mathieu Olivier for a headshot on the Caps’ Declan Chisholm. Was it the right call?
• Tampa Bay Lightning’s Emil Lilleberg puts the puck into the net off referee Frederick L’Ecuyer. Rule 78.5 says that one doesn’t count.
• Chaos at Penguins vs. Flyers. Who saw that coming? We’ve got disallowed goals, Sidney Crosby and Trevor Zegras rules ineligible for the shootout, and a premature substitution - which is, what, exactly?
• Was it a slew foot? Vegas Golden Knights’ defenseman Jeremy Lauzon sweeps the leg on Carolina Hurricanes winger Nik Ehlers. 
• Chicago’s Colton Dach deflects in an empty-netter on a delayed penalty… which doesn’t count. Rule 78.5 strikes again, but this time it’s section 11.
• Minnesota Wild’s Matt Boldy is wrongfully convicted of a high sticking penalty after the pick catches Winnipeg’s Dylan DeMelo up high. Coach John Hynes loses his mind, Boldly heads to the box… and, later, ref Gord Dwyer apologies. More on the call and why they couldn’t review it.
• Goaltender interference at Kings vs. Wings, as Kevin Fiala finds his way into the blue paint.
• The Situation Room gets some well-deserved upgrades, with some interesting inspiration.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• Author Don Weekes joins Todd and Josh to discuss his new book Hockey Hall of Fame Timeline of the Game: 150 Years of Hockey Stories
• Referee Michael Markovic has a 'Steve Harvey' moment after he announces the wrong call - and immediately corrects it - at Panthers vs. Devils
• Vancouver Canucks defenseman Tyler Myers fined for slashing Edmonton Oilers captain Connor McDavid right in the twig and berries
• Utah Mammoth blueliner Ian Cole picks up a fine for a dangerous trip on the Nashville Predators' Steven Stamkos.
• Ottawa Senators goaltender Linus Ullmark flashes the leather for a glove save on Evan Rodrigues of the Florida Panthers only to drop the puck right into his own net. We break down the continuous play rule.
• The refs eventually sort out which member of the Toronto Maple Leafs - Auston Matthews or Simon Benoit - was responsible for putting the puck over the glass
• Bum rap as Thomas Chabot picks up a high sticking penalty - that stands after review - when it was Florida's Eetu Luostarinen
• Nashville's Ozzy Wiesblatt gets away with a dangerous play sfter he shoves the Leafs' Easton Cowan into the goal cage.
• Goaltender intereference is back! We check out a lenghty review from Sens/Preds and a controversial call from Philadelphia Flyers vs. Carolina Hurricanes that saw Freddie Andersen shove Travis Sanheim in the goal crease.
• In the KHL, a video goal judge is fired after getting the goal call wrong.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• Preseason wrap-up
• 322 penalty minutes for Panthers vs. Lightning in the fiercely nasty battle of Florida
• What happens when an ejected player comes back on the ice and nobody notices? What about when he scores a goal? This is not what Niko Mikkola or the NHL had in mind.
• AJ Greer and Nick Foligno throw down in the first fight of the NHL season
• The Nashville Predators issue the first Coach's Challenge of the season... for goaltender interference, of course
• Calgary Flames defenseman Mackenzie Weegar has a boarding penalty downgraded and a minor penalty upgraded to a misconduct after arguing with the ref
• The Islanders' Jonathan Drouin gets ejected for a cross-check to the face of the Penguins' Connor Dewar
• Wes McCauley signs autographs for the fans
• ...and one KHLer found a better - though not exactly legal - way to cut down on the passing lanes.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• Say my name, say my name
• Taking a page out of the College Football replay book
• Ottawa Senators and Montreal Canadiens brawl in Quebec, piling up 150 PIM
• Senators' Nick Cousins (slashing) and Hayden Hodgson (boarding) both pick up fines
• Sens' Donovan Sebrango gets ejected but avoids supplemental discipline from NHL Player Safety
• The Florida Panthers and Tampa Bay Lightning combine for 186 PIM, filling up the penalty boxes
• The Panthers' AJ Greer delivers a gloved sucker-punch to the Bolts' Brandon Hagel
• With the linesmen busy, Yanni Gourde and Luke Kunin each drop a glove. That's right. Just one.
• Calgary Flames' Martin Pospisil cross-checks Seattle Kraken defenseman Vince Dunn in the face
• Was Matvei Gridin's game-winning shootout goal legal? We're not so sure...

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code REFS2026 for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton - promo code REFS2026 - to save $100 per guest. 

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

Missed goals, unlimited high sticks, and line brawls!

The new guys hit the ice in the National Hockey League!

Which NHL officials have yet to take the ice? Steve Kozari, Shandor Alphonso, and Bryan Pancich are still working their way back from injuries last season.

New York Rangers winger Brennan Othmann picked up a major penalty and a game misconduct for elbowing Calen Addison of the New Jersey Devils, but no file, no suspension from NHL Player Safety.

If a puck goes in and nobody sees it, is it a goal? Apparently not, as the Washington Capitals' Vincent Iorio found out.

The WCHA eliminates high-sticking altogether.

We throw back the clock for a good old-fashioned line brawl in the QMJHL, with plenty of penalty minutes and suspensions to the players involved.

Plus, it's not just refs who get promoted -- their bosses do, too. Riley Yerkovich joins the AHL as Director of Officiating and Player Safety, while Casey Terreri gets the call up to take that job in the ECHL.

Clear your calendars! Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code [REFS2026] for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton, promo code [REFS2026], to save $100 per guest. 

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

Kicking off the 2025-26 season!

• Wrapping up NHL officials’ training camp
• Promotions for ref Jordan Samuels-Thomas and liney Ryan Jackson
• New names joining the NHL: referee Ben Betker and linespersons Dylan Blujus, Jeremy Faucher, and Shawn Oliver. 
• Retirements of referee Ghislain Hebert and linesman Derek Nansen
• But, wait – Hebert’s not done yet! He’s wearing the stripes in Germany!
• The NHL makes a few minor changes to the NHL rulebook, including officially adding “common sense” to the book, an offside clarification, a new high-sticking definition, and some added hand-pass criteria.
• We haven’t even played a game and Linus Ullmark is already complaining about goaltender interference. He’s got an interesting proposal.  

Oh, and have we got some summer plans for you...

Oilers fans—imagine spending a week in the sun with Edmonton legends! The Edmonton Hockey Legends Cruise 2026 sails July 17–24, 2026 aboard Royal Caribbean’s Navigator of the Seas, cruising the Mexican Riviera.

On board: Jason Strudwick, Bill Ranford, Ron Low, Gene Principe, Jack Michaels, Kelly Buchberger, and Louie DeBrusk.

You’ll get meet & greets, hot-stove sessions, Q&A panels, autographs, and a chance to watch the World Cup Final at sea with the legends. Cabins start at $2,399 CAD, and it’s just a $500 deposit to lock it in.

Book at cast.tours/edmonton and use promo code [REFS2026] for $100 off per person—again, that’s cast.tours/edmonton, promo code [REFS2026], to save $100 per guest. 

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

Looking at the calls - and non-calls - from Games 5 and 6 of the NHL Stanley Cup Final between the Edmonton Oilers and Florida Panthers

• What happened to all the penalties?
• Is Panthers’ Brad Marchand getting the jump on faceoffs?
• Are the refs ‘letting ‘em play’ or missing calls?
• Florida's Reinhart scores off his skate - legally - in Game 6.
• When was the last time we had no power plays in a Stanley Cup Final?
• Oilers’ Evander Kane picks up a misconduct then skips the handshake line

Rulebook drama in the AHL’s Calder Cup Final between the Charlotte Checkers and the Abbotsford Canucks

• Game 1 saw an overtime game-winning goal called back after the goaltender wasn’t ready for the drop. Whose fault is that? Digging into rules 76 and 83.
• In Game 2, we had a goal disallowed for goaltender interference, only to have the goal count after review… but the scoring team assessed a minor penalty for goaltender interference. There’s only one way that makes sense… and, frankly, we’re not so sure it makes sense here.

...and what will the NHL refs be doing this summer?

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• Looking back at Games 3 and 4  of the Stanley Cup Final between the Edmonton Oilers and the Florida Panthers as the series shifts south.
• Evander Kane finds himself in penalty trouble early… and again… and again.
• Before the end of the game, both teams piled on the penalty minutes, racking up the fourth-most minutes in a Stanley Cup Final
• Oilers’ Jake Walman commits the cardinal sin of squirting a water bottle, picking up a $5000 fine – and another $5000 for unsportsmanlike conduct against Matthew Tkachuk
• Consistency… or lack thereof.
• Conspiracies… or lack thereof.
• Panthers’ Barkov gets away with a high stick on Edmonton’s Troy Stetcher just prior to a Florida goal.
• Carter Verhaege avoids a penalty for boarding on a hit from behind on Evan Bouchard
• Jeff Skinner holds Dmitry Kulikov’s stick for an entire shift - from puck drop until a goal is scored - with no call.  Kulikov attempts to seek out revenge with an equally-unpenalized flying elbow.  Sure, Skinner avoided contact and possible injury on the play, but does that mean Kulikov should get off scot-free?
• Linesman Ryan Gibbons keeps the arm up for icing, even after getting tangled up with Evander Kane. Focus!
• You can’t do a line change after an icing, so why can you put the goalie back into an empty net?
• The NHL Awards have been handed out but we’re still missing one very important award.

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

------------------

Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• Was it a kick? Or a deflection? Or both? Stars/Jets gives us a controversial goal that went off Alex Petrovic’s skate, off goaltender Connor Hellebuyck’s stick and in. Did the Situation Room make the right call?

• Official injury updates; two linesmen are out for the playoffs

• NHL Series Supervisors - who are they and what do they do?

• Dallas Stars’ Mason Marchment slashes referee Graham Skilliter - and gets away with it

• A crosscheck to the face results in a $7000 fine to Vegas Golden Knights’ Nic Roy, which is over the $5000 we always hear is the ‘maximum allowable under the CBA’

• A high stick is legal when it’s a follow-through, but that wasn’t the case for the Winnipeg Jets’ Haydn Fleury.

• Also, it’s not a penalty when you high stick your team trainer, as Tomas Hertl found out.

• Carolina head coach Rod Brind’Amour was furious after a high-sticking penalty to Jordan Staal was really the result of friendly fire, but not eligible for review. 

• Toronto Maple Leafs’ Max Domi was fined for a late hit on Florida Panthers’ Sasha Barkov, but there was no call and no fine for an attempted elbow by Dmitry Kulikov on Mitch Marner.

• Plus, what is a fight in the IIHF, and how did one scrum result in three fighting majors at France vs. Slovakia? The answer - and the definition - might surprise you.

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• Creative crowd chants - more than just ‘ref you suck’

• Officials set for the IIHF World Championship as well as in the OHL Championship Series and the USHL Clark Cup Final
• A minor incident at Leafs/Panthers between Sam Bennett and Anthony Stolarz results in an injury but no call, no fine, no suspension
• Referee Wes McCauley is called into duty as a linesman after an injury to Shandor Alphonso, working this lines for the first time in the NHL
• Florida Panthers’ Evan Rodrigues gets crunched into the boards by the Toronto Maple Leafs’ Scott Laughton, with each player picking up a minor penalty on the play as Rodrigues is whistled for embellishment. After review, we’re not so sure about that one…
• Edmonton’s Connor Brown takes a penalty for goaltender interference, but it looks like the contact was caused by Vegas forward Brett Howden
• Vegas Golden Knights forward Nicolas Roy gets ejected in overtime - major penalty and game misconduct - for a crosscheck to the face of Edmonton Oilers’ Trent Frederic
• No call in overtime on the Oilers’ Viktor Arvidsson for a dangerous trip on Vegas defenseman Brayden McNabb, who crashed awkwardly into the boards and suffered an injury on the play.
• The Athletic’s Rule Court gives us some interesting suggestions to weigh in on. Our take on possible tweaks to offside, playoff standings, and faceoffs – including one that would have a huge unexpected (and probably well-received) impact.

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.

On this week's #RefsPodcast:

• NHL Stanley Cup Playoff Round 2 officials announced!
• Double-review in Vegas as the Minnesota Wild's Ryan Hartman has a goal reviewed for a distinct kicking motion... and called back after an offside challenge.
• No penalty but a 2-game suspension to the Panthers' Aaron Ekblad for a hit on the Lightning's Brandon Hagel.
• Major penalty to Florida's Niko Mikkola for boarding Zemgus Girgensons.
• Blues' Brayden Schenn whistled for interference for a hit that injured Winnipeg Jets' Mark Scheifele.
• A pre-game Nylander mix-up nearly costs the Toronto Maple Leafs thanks to Rule 5.2.
• Colorado's Jack Drury gets called for a rare third-period playoff penalty for an obvious faceoff tackle
• Twice, players cover the puck in the crease at Kings/Oilers, and twice no penalty shot is awarded; twice, it should have been.
• Should the playoffs be called the same way as the regular season?
• Allan Walsh is not happy with playoff officiating.
• The Kings' Warren Foegele gets away with a little abuse of officials on liney Libor Suchanek...

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Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠ and follow @scoutingtherefs and @toddlewissports on Twitter/X, Instagram, BlueSky, and Threads. Email us your questions - ⁠⁠⁠⁠heyref@scoutingtherefs.com⁠⁠⁠⁠

Questions? Comments? Just looking to vent? Call the RefLine and leave us a message at 585-484-REFS!⁠⁠⁠⁠ #RefsPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠

The Scouting The Refs Podcast is a weekly look at the world of officiating and player safety within the National Hockey League, AHL, ECHL, and other leagues around the world. We'll break down the calls and the rules behind them to help understand why a penalty or suspension was - or wasn't - handed out.