In this Jam Session, host Conrad Smith sits down with Jay Sklar from Hub International for a masterclass in high-velocity procurement.
With Hub International acquiring an average of five companies every single month, Jay has developed a battle-tested playbook for rapid integration. He shares how he manages a massive portfolio of 700+ offices while leveraging his company's explosive growth to secure better deals with suppliers.
In this episode, we cover:
🏢 Procurement Meets Real Estate: How Jay manages a dual role and drives "operating expense" savings by optimizing office density and design.
🚀 The M&A Engine: How to use your company's growth story to tell suppliers to "hitch their wagon" to you for better pricing.
🛑 The Nuclear Option: Jay’s strategy for fighting unjustified 2x software price hikes (and why you have to be willing to "rip and replace").
🤖 AI Pragmatism: Why we need less theory and more "show and tell" in the procurement AI sandbox.
💡 Best Advice: Why "being a nice person" is the secret weapon of successful M&A integration.
Whether you are dealing with software inflation or managing a complex real estate portfolio, this episode is packed with practical tips you can use today.
Happy 1st Birthday to Proc & Roll! 🎂🎸
Can you believe it has been a whole year? In this special anniversary episode, hosts Conrad Smith, Natasha Gurevich, and Zach Bachir put aside the interview scripts to reminisce on the journey from episode 1 to 35+.
What started as a random lunch in London turned into a community of "operators in the trenches," and we wouldn't be here without you!
In this episode, we cover:
The Origin Story: How a cold email and a lunch sparked a deep friendship and a podcast.
The AI Rewind: Conrad uses Google’s NotebookLM live on the show to analyze our entire year of transcripts, revealing our biggest themes (from Ethics to "Savings vs. Value").
Best Guest Moments: We look back at game-changing conversations with Dr. Elouise Epstein, Mark Raffan, Alyssa Harvey Dawson, Ana Erickson, Ash Hall, MVK (Michael Van Keulen), Josh Earley, Arnaud de Brux, and David Johnson, plus we preview upcoming episodes with Ted Baumuller and Jay Sklar.
2026 Teasers: A sneak peek at upcoming episodes featuring CHROs discussing layoffs and a deep dive into the CFO relationship.
Whether you are a CPO or a new category manager, thank you for rocking with us this year. Here’s to many more! 🥂
"We jumped off a cliff and built the plane on the way down." ✈️
That is how Arnaud, Head of Indirect Procurement at BIC, describes the massive challenge of building a non-GMO supply chain from scratch in just 18 months.
In this Jam Session, Arnaud joins Conrad to explore how an industrial engineering mindset can transform procurement from a transactional function into a strategic engine for growth. They discuss how to look beyond the price tag to see the total cost of ownership—whether you are buying machinery for a factory or software for HR.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
If you want to learn how to break down silos and engineer value, this jam session is for you.
"Don't let IT select the technology." 🛑That is just one of the hard-hitting pieces of advice from Michael Van Keulen (MVK), Chief Customer Officer at Green Cabbage and former CPO at Coupa, Lululemon, and VF Corporation.In this jam session, MVK joins the Proc & Roll team to break down the explosion of the procurement tech market. With thousands of solutions now available, how do you choose the right stack? MVK argues that the days of the 500-question RFP are over and that tech selection must be treated as a business project, not a procurement one.In this episode, you’ll learn:The "Platform vs. Point Solution" Verdict: Why MVK believes you need a core "single source of truth" augmented by best-of-breed apps—and why trying to stitch together 10 different solutions is crazy.How NOT to Buy Tech: Why running a massive RFP is a mistake, and why you should focus on defining the business problem (like store visibility) rather than feature lists.The IT Trap: Why IT should be a partner, but never the decision-maker for your technology roadmap.AI Predictions: Why MVK and the team believe AI will eventually automate 50-80% of tactical procurement work, freeing us to finally focus on strategy.Implementation Secrets: The three top "Do's" for a successful rollout: Involve stakeholders early, prioritize people/process over tech, and treat it as a cross-functional business project.If you are navigating a digital transformation or struggling to get budget for new tools, this episode is your playbook.About Proc & RollProc & Roll is your guide to practical procurement, where we make procurement rock and roll. Hosted by industry veterans Natasha Gurevich, Conrad Smith, and Zachary Bachir, we tackle the biggest topics and trends to help you level up your procurement game.
Can you build a fully functional AI procurement agent in just 50 hours?
In this special "Show and Tell" episode, host Zachary Bachir rolls up his sleeves to demonstrate an AI intake agent he built from scratch using N8n, a low-code automation platform.
Join Conrad, Natasha, and Zach for a hands-on look at the future of agentic workflows. Zach creates a live purchase requisition via email, and the agent parses the intent, checks it against procurement policy using RAG (Retrieval Augmented Generation), and drafts a perfect response, all without human intervention.
You’ll learn:
✔️ How to Build Your Own Agent: A live demo of an orchestration agent that manages sub-agents (like a "Commercial Analyst" and "Compliance Analyst") to handle stakeholder requests.
✔️ Demystifying RAG: Zach explains how to use Retrieval Augmented Generation to turn unstructured data—like PDF contracts and policy documents—into a database your AI can actually read and use.
✔️ The "Buy vs. Build" Debate: Natasha challenges the risks of "Shadow AI." Should every procurement pro be building their own tools, or does this create chaos?.
✔️ The 50-Hour Investment: Why spending just one week learning these tools can make you a "dangerous" negotiator when buying tech from suppliers.
✔️ The Future of the Center of Excellence: Why procurement functions need to invest in internal technical teams to design these flows, even if the average buyer doesn't write code.
If you’ve been waiting for a practical, under-the-hood look at how AI agents actually work, do not miss this episode.
"Just because you can build an AI agent in five minutes, doesn't mean you should use it for enterprise procurement."
In this episode, Josh Earley joins the team for a deep dive into the often-overlooked but critical topic of AI governance. As employees start bringing their own AI tools to work, procurement faces a new wave of "shadow AI" risks—from unapproved contracts to broken workflows.
Josh, Natasha, and Zach discuss how to build guardrails without stifling innovation and what the rise of autonomous agents means for the future of sourcing.
You'll learn:
✔️ The "Shadow AI" Threat: Why "citizen developers" building unapproved workflows create massive risk for procurement .
✔️ The 150-Question RFP Problem: How suppliers will use AI to spam massive RFPs with unverified "AI slop" .
✔️ Governance 101: Josh's advice to "start small" by aligning Legal and Technology to build a policy framework .
✔️ Knowledge as a Commodity: A philosophical look at what happens when human expertise is uploaded into models .
What if you could automate the most painful parts of your procurement job right now? In this hands-on "jam session," Conrad is joined by David Johnson for a practical guide to using AI in procurement.
David shares his incredible "origin story" of falling through a ceiling into a procurement career, and then dives into a live demo of how he uses Google's Notebook LM to revolutionize the RFP process.
You’ll learn how to:
✔️ Automate RFP Analysis: Watch David demonstrate how he uses Notebook LM to instantly synthesize multiple vendor RFP responses, generate audio summaries, and query data with natural language.
✔️ Streamline Scoring: Learn how to use AI to build automated scorecards based on your requirements document and vendor responses.
✔️ Build Your Own AI Assistant: David explains the difference between Notebook LM and Gemini Gems, showing how to create a personalized AI "Gem" trained on your specific documents and tone.
✔️ Predict Outcomes: A look at the future of AI in strategic sourcing, where agents will model negotiation scenarios and analyze supplier financial reports to find leverage.
✔️ Embrace the Tools: Why AI isn't going to take your job, but it will take the "parts of your job you don't want to do," like auditing POs and redlining contracts.
If you're ready to move beyond the hype and start using AI to solve real problems today, this episode is for you.
As AI and automation change the procurement landscape, what skills will you actually need to stay relevant?
Natasha, Conrad, and Zach break down how the profession is evolving from a narrow focus on savings to a strategic function centered on value, speed, and customer service. They provide a practical guide on the new critical skills required for CPOs, directors, and individual contributors to thrive in the age of AI.
You’ll learn about the new skills for:
✔️ The CPO (Chief Procurement Officer): The CPO's role is shifting to that of an "inspirer" and a "catalyst of a change". Natasha argues CPOs will spend as much as 70% of their time on "sales"—selling their vision to the organization. They must be "knowledgeable enough to ask the right questions" about new tech and possess the "intuition" to "zoom in on the things that matter".
✔️ Directors & Mid-Level Leaders: This level needs an "absolute willingness and even enthusiasm around change". They must also be "bolder" in hiring to bring in diverse skill sets like data science and coding to build a more capable team.
✔️ Individual Contributors & Category Managers: As AI automates technical knowledge, "soft skills" like EQ are being prioritized. The hosts suggest hiring people with backgrounds in English and philosophy , warning that if 80% of your job is done by ChatGPT, "you're not going to have that position for a very long time". The key is to use AI to "elevate your thinking," not replace it.
Ultimately, the hosts conclude that as technology takes over tactical work, the "human side of things" and skills like "influence, impact, and empowering" are "more important than ever" at every level of the organization.
What happens to your job when an AI agent can do 80% of your administrative work for you? In this mini jam session, hosts Conrad Smith and Zachary Bachir have a raw and forward-looking conversation sparked by the release of OpenAI's new agentic browser, Atlas. They explore how this technology will fundamentally change not just how procurement tasks are done, but what procurement professionals will focus on in the future.The hosts predict a massive shift in the skills required to succeed, moving away from operational expertise and toward strategic relationship management.You’ll hear candid views on:
Learn more about Atlas at: chatgpt.com/atlas
Veteran CPO Ash Hall joins us to give his practical advice for career progression and leadership in procurement. Ash gives us his playbook on how to navigate career changes, make an impact in a new role, and evolve as a leader. Learn how he used a detailed and actionable framework for his first 90-day plan to transform multiple procurement organizations.
In This Episode, You Will Learn:
Is the traditional RFP a "disgusting," "sloppy," and "painful" process that needs to be retired? In this passionate episode, the Proc & Roll team declares war on the traditional Request for Proposal. Join Natasha, Conrad, and Zach as they break down why the process is broken and empower procurement leaders to "take back control".
In this episode, we cover:
"Change the Freaking Policy": Why you shouldn't be a victim of your own rules and have the power to change them.
The "Game Master" Mindset: How to design a sourcing process that actually fits your needs instead of defaulting to a one-size-fits-all RFP.
The "19-Supplier" Problem: The classic sign that your team hasn't done its homework before going to market.
Practical Alternatives: Moving beyond the traditional RFP to smarter tools like creative reverse auctions and Proof of Concepts (POCs).
The "Best RFP Responder" Fallacy: The danger of picking the supplier who is best at filling out paperwork, not the one who is the best partner.
In a tough negotiation, where do you draw the line between a strategic bluff and an unethical lie?
In this episode, Natasha, Conrad, and Zach continue their in-depth exploration of procurement ethics, focusing on the practical, in-the-moment dilemmas of negotiation. The hosts share candidly about their own personal values, the pressures they've faced, and the frameworks they use to make tough calls.
You’ll hear candid views on:
✔️ Bluffing vs. Lying: The hosts debate the fine line between the two, with Natasha warning that you must be prepared to have your bluff called.
✔️ The "Slippery Slope": Conrad's theory that major ethical breaches don't start overnight but begin with small, questionable actions, like with travel expenses, that become normalized over time.
✔️ The "Third Party Test": A practical framework for judging your actions: if a neutral third party were watching you, what would they think your intentions are?
✔️ Personal Values (The Mirror Test): The ultimate conclusion that your long-term reputation and ability to feel good about your actions are more important than any single deal.
✔️ Responding to Unethical Behavior: What to do when a supplier "plays dirty" or, even more difficult, when you observe unethical behavior from a senior leader in your own company.
The conversation on procurement ethics and integrity continues, and this time, the hosts have brought in a special guest: a real "proc star," Ash Hall, former head of procurement at Lincoln Electric and Mercury Systems.
Join Natasha Gurevich, Conrad Smith, and their guest Ash Hall as they dive deep into the practical, "in the trenches" dilemmas of the RFP process. They share candid stories and expert advice on how to build a sourcing process founded on fairness, transparency, and respect.
In this episode, we cover:
The "Slippery Slope": The hosts discuss how small, seemingly minor unethical habits can become normalized and grow into bigger problems over time.
The Unethical RFP: A deep dive into why running a bid when you have no intention of moving off the legacy supplier is disrespectful and can ruin your company's reputation to the point where suppliers refuse to bid.
"Respect" as a Core Principle: The idea that being respectful of a supplier's time and effort by running a lean and effective process is a fundamental part of integrity.
Listen to Ash's Band, The Slamheads
In Loving Memory of David Karl Johnson (1966-2018)
Is your procurement process truly ethical, or are there hidden gray areas you haven't considered? In this episode, the Proc & Roll team tackles the critical and complex topic of ethics and integrity.
Join Natasha Gurevich, Conrad Smith, and Zachary Bachir as they move beyond clear-cut issues like bribery to explore the subtle, everyday dilemmas that professionals face in negotiations, RFPs, and stakeholder management. This is a must-listen for anyone looking to build a stronger personal foundation of integrity in their work.
In this episode, we cover:
The "continuum of influence": Where to draw the line between a golf outing and a bribe.
Internal pressure: How to handle it when a senior leader asks you to "put your finger on the scale" for a favored supplier.
The "benchmark bid" dilemma: Why asking suppliers for a quote when you have no real intention of awarding them the business is the "opposite from ethical".
Negotiation ethics: Are "white lies" and bluffing acceptable, or can you get a good deal with 100% transparency?
The "fourth jet" problem: The ethical questions that arise when one department is pinching pennies while another spends lavishly on things like a private jet.
Procurement reports millions in savings, but does the CFO actually believe the numbers? In this follow-up to our savings discussion, the Proc & Roll team tackles the biggest challenge in procurement: credibility.
Join Natasha Gurevich, Conrad Smith, and Zachary Bachir as they share candid stories and practical strategies for building unshakeable trust with your finance partners. They break down why even the biggest savings numbers fall flat without the right validation and communication, and how to translate procurement "value" into the tangible currency your CFO wants to see.
In this episode, we cover:
The "wheelbarrow of money" analogy: What the CFO really wants to see from your savings reports.
Why the lack of a unified code for defining savings creates confusion and mistrust between CPOs and CFOs.
The specific role of Finance as a "validator"—not an approver—to make your numbers "bulletproof".
The importance of speaking two languages: talking hard currency with Finance and value with business stakeholders.
The challenge of cost avoidance, why it's often treated as a "stepchild" by CFOs, and how to explain its importance for protecting future margins.
If you’ve ever struggled to get your savings report taken seriously, this episode provides a clear playbook.
It's the proverbial 2 a.m. call from the CFO: "The quarter is bad, I need your team to deliver savings". Do you become the "cost police" and start squeezing suppliers, or do you step up as a strategic partner?
In this episode, Natasha Gurevich, Conrad Smith, and Zach Bachir tackle the "S-word" of procurement. They share a practical playbook for generating real value under pressure, moving beyond simple cost-cutting to strategic leadership. This conversation is for any procurement professional who wants to be prepared before that inevitable call comes.
In this episode, we cover:
The crucial first step: Understanding the
real driver behind a savings request and how much license you have to push for cuts.
The proactive building blocks every team needs: clean spend data, accessible contracts, and strong stakeholder relationships.
Why your relationship with Finance must be "iron" solid and how it makes your savings numbers "bulletproof".
The full spectrum of savings levers, from a simple "just ask" to transformational operating model changes.
If you’ve ever faced a sudden demand for cost reduction or want to elevate your team from a tactical function to a strategic powerhouse, this conversation is for you.
ESG is a top priority for many companies, but are we approaching it the right way?In this episode, Zachary, Natasha, and Conrad explore the realities of procurement's role in driving Environmental, Social, and Governance initiatives. They move beyond theory to discuss how to make ESG a practical, value-driving part of your strategy, not just another corporate checkbox.Drawing on decades of experience at companies like Nike, Salesforce, and Intel, the hosts share hard lessons and practical strategies for making ESG a powerful engine for innovation and positive change, all while strengthening the business.You’ll hear candid views on:✔️ Why ESG should be viewed as a strategic opportunity, not just another 'deliverable'.✔️ The difference between chasing metrics (the letter of the law) and making a real impact (the spirit of the law).✔️ The surprising economic multiplier effect of spending with diverse suppliers.✔️ How to navigate conflicting priorities like supplier consolidation vs. supplier diversity.✔️ A creative negotiating tactic that trades price cuts for sustainability investments.✔️ Why you don't need a big budget to get started and can achieve up to 80% of your goals without new tech.✔️ How to use scorecards and QBRs to drive meaningful change with your suppliers.If you've ever felt that ESG is just a 'flavor of the month' or wondered how to make a real difference from your role in procurement, this conversation is for you.
AI is poised to change everything, but will it fix the strained relationship between Legal and Procurement, or make it worse?
In this special episode, Natasha and Conrad are joined by two legal powerhouses, Alissa Harvey Dawson and Ana Erickson, to explore the critical intersection of technology, law, and procurement. They discuss how to move beyond friction, leverage AI responsibly, and build a truly aligned partnership that drives business forward.
With decades of combined experience from companies like HubSpot, Gusto, IBM, and McKesson , our guests provide an unparalleled view from both inside the legal department and from the perspective of a procurement-pro-turned-lawyer.
Topics in this episode include:
Why legal is often the slowest function to adopt new technology—and how to overcome the resistance.
Practical ways to use AI for contract summarization, clause comparison, and initial drafting today.
The secret to getting Legal and Procurement on the same page by aligning on business strategy and risk tolerance.
The human element: What AI can't replace in understanding deal dynamics and complex relationships.
Building proactive supplier resiliency in an era of tariffs and global disruption.
The biggest risks of AI, like hallucinations and bias, and how to manage them responsibly.
If you’re a professional caught between legal hurdles and procurement deadlines, or wondering how to safely harness the power of AI, this conversation provides an expert playbook for the future of your field.
Contracts are a fundamental part of procurement, but are we making them more complicated than they need to be? In this episode, Zachary, Natasha, and Conrad dive deep into the realities of contracting in procurement. They discuss when a contract is truly necessary, how to balance speed with risk, and why procurement and legal teams often find themselves at odds.
Drawing on their combined decades of experience at companies like Nike, Adobe, and KPMG, the hosts share personal stories, lessons learned, and practical strategies to help procurement professionals streamline their contract processes.
Topics in this episode include:
Why most contracts are never referenced again after signing
The hidden costs of over-engineering contracts
When legal teams should step in, and when they shouldn’t
Reducing friction between procurement and legal
Using AI and automation to handle routine contract work
Building smarter intake and approval processes that actually work
If you’ve ever found yourself bogged down by contract redlines, approval delays, or legal bottlenecks, this conversation offers actionable advice on making contracting faster, smarter, and more business-friendly.
🎸 Automate Like a Rock Star: AI Agents in Procurement 🎸
In this episode of Proc-N-Roll, Conrad and Zach explore how procurement professionals can harness the power of AI agents and workflow automation to revolutionize contract management and beyond.
Zach walks through a practical demo of building an AI-driven contract analysis tool using Zapier, OpenAI’s GPT-4, and Google Sheets, showing how anyone can get started in just 5-10 hours — no coding experience required!
Tune in to learn:
✅ What agentic AI really means for procurement✅ How to build smart workflows with low-code tools✅ Real-world use cases for automating contract review
✅ Tips to future-proof your procurement team with AI skills
This episode is a must-listen for procurement pros looking to stay ahead of the curve and make AI a core part of their practice.
🎧 Hit play and let’s Proc-N-Roll!
#Procurement #AI #Automation #Workflows #Zapier #OpenAI #ContractManagement #ProcNRoll